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	<title>Comments on: Seagate gets hybrid SSD/HDD right</title>
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	<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/</link>
	<description>Data storage info &#38; analysis</description>
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		<title>By: Seagate pushes deeper into SSDs with Samsung acquistion - Storage Soup</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-215736</link>
		<dc:creator>Seagate pushes deeper into SSDs with Samsung acquistion - Storage Soup</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Apr 2011 13:44:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-215736</guid>
		<description>[...] also sells hybrid systems with SSDs and hard [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] also sells hybrid systems with SSDs and hard [...]</p>
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		<title>By: David Jonas</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-214924</link>
		<dc:creator>David Jonas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Feb 2011 21:21:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-214924</guid>
		<description>are the controllers on these swappable without needing any soldering or identical firmware and/or logicware ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>are the controllers on these swappable without needing any soldering or identical firmware and/or logicware ?</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Reiter</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-214655</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Reiter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Jan 2011 06:44:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-214655</guid>
		<description>Hi Robin,

I put one of these drives in my MBP i7, not as a boot drive, but as a replacement to my optical drive for use in storing virtual instrument libraries. I installed an OCZ Agility 240gb drive as my boot drive. It was a real toss up as to what would serve me best. What I really wanted was a 500gb SSD drive to serve as my optical drive replacement, but the prices are still too crazy right now.  I have discovered that the boot time is er, ok.  As I have some of my virtual instrument libraries stored on the SSD boot drive, I have to constantly battle having enough space on that drive.  My optical replacement: Momentus XT 550gb has been filled up to 90% since day one.  

What I have experienced as the best performance gain from having my OCZ 240 gb SSD boot drive is application start up, but I could get that same performance gain from having a second Momentus XT 500gb drive serving as my boot drive, which is why I have just purchased a second one recently. I&#039;m in the process of getting my energy level up again to want to tear apart my MBP to go through this tedious process all over again! 

My next experiment will be using two Momentus XT 500gb drives in my MBP i7 and using my OCZ Agility 240 SSD as an external 1394b drive for virtual instrument libraries.

Yup, I shoulda waited on the OCZ Agility drive, but it does run cooler than the Momentus XT.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Robin,</p>
<p>I put one of these drives in my MBP i7, not as a boot drive, but as a replacement to my optical drive for use in storing virtual instrument libraries. I installed an OCZ Agility 240gb drive as my boot drive. It was a real toss up as to what would serve me best. What I really wanted was a 500gb SSD drive to serve as my optical drive replacement, but the prices are still too crazy right now.  I have discovered that the boot time is er, ok.  As I have some of my virtual instrument libraries stored on the SSD boot drive, I have to constantly battle having enough space on that drive.  My optical replacement: Momentus XT 550gb has been filled up to 90% since day one.  </p>
<p>What I have experienced as the best performance gain from having my OCZ 240 gb SSD boot drive is application start up, but I could get that same performance gain from having a second Momentus XT 500gb drive serving as my boot drive, which is why I have just purchased a second one recently. I&#8217;m in the process of getting my energy level up again to want to tear apart my MBP to go through this tedious process all over again! </p>
<p>My next experiment will be using two Momentus XT 500gb drives in my MBP i7 and using my OCZ Agility 240 SSD as an external 1394b drive for virtual instrument libraries.</p>
<p>Yup, I shoulda waited on the OCZ Agility drive, but it does run cooler than the Momentus XT.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-210842</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Sep 2010 19:45:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-210842</guid>
		<description>Oracle uses this type of technology in the Exadata machine. Logically, there&#039;s disk, flash storage and memory. Depending on the need for the data (statistics again), the data is copied onto flash or taken into memory for speedy access. 
Nice to see that similar things are coming to the consumer market.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oracle uses this type of technology in the Exadata machine. Logically, there&#8217;s disk, flash storage and memory. Depending on the need for the data (statistics again), the data is copied onto flash or taken into memory for speedy access.<br />
Nice to see that similar things are coming to the consumer market.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Edwards</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-210822</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Edwards</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Sep 2010 20:40:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-210822</guid>
		<description>Seagate has a video comparing four different technologies (SSD, Hybrid, 10K, 7200) on the same laptop with a clean boot straight to a test package.  There&#039;s certainly a grain of salt to be taken with the video, but it was interesting just the same.  I imagine power consumption is somewhat more than the stock HD, but still they make a compelling sales pitch if you can get near SSD performance with standard HD capacity for only a relatively small premium.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seagate has a video comparing four different technologies (SSD, Hybrid, 10K, 7200) on the same laptop with a clean boot straight to a test package.  There&#8217;s certainly a grain of salt to be taken with the video, but it was interesting just the same.  I imagine power consumption is somewhat more than the stock HD, but still they make a compelling sales pitch if you can get near SSD performance with standard HD capacity for only a relatively small premium.</p>
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		<title>By: james. braselton</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-210779</link>
		<dc:creator>james. braselton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 29 Aug 2010 02:54:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-210779</guid>
		<description>hi. there. darkfader. i. am. too waiting for the. 2.5 inch. 15,000. rpm.   8. gb.  ssd. flash. drive. hybrid. be. great. for. my. ps3.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hi. there. darkfader. i. am. too waiting for the. 2.5 inch. 15,000. rpm.   8. gb.  ssd. flash. drive. hybrid. be. great. for. my. ps3.</p>
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		<title>By: james braselton</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209947</link>
		<dc:creator>james braselton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jul 2010 19:10:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209947</guid>
		<description>hi  there  wow  ssd  150  times  faster  then  hard  drives  why  has  sony  not  gone   ssd  for  ps3?  it  is   soo  slow  with  the  hard  drive  i  hope  that  this  hybrid  technology  can be  applied  to  a  raptor  or  cheeta  hdd  at 10,000  or  15,000  rpms.  that&#039;d  be  awsome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hi  there  wow  ssd  150  times  faster  then  hard  drives  why  has  sony  not  gone   ssd  for  ps3?  it  is   soo  slow  with  the  hard  drive  i  hope  that  this  hybrid  technology  can be  applied  to  a  raptor  or  cheeta  hdd  at 10,000  or  15,000  rpms.  that&#8217;d  be  awsome.</p>
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		<title>By: darkfader</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209503</link>
		<dc:creator>darkfader</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jun 2010 23:28:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209503</guid>
		<description>Nice review, but...

are you aware your system is crammed full?

I&#039;m wondering if my girlfriend&#039;s OS X desktop is still the worst I ever saw. But yours appears still a bit sorted ;)

Anyway, I&#039;m just waiting for seagate to bring the same hybrid option for a combo of 2.5&quot; 15k drives with 8GB SLC. The price difference is so nicely low and I don&#039;t think we&#039;ll see cheaper, easier self-tuning storage tiering for a long time to come.

Florian</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice review, but&#8230;</p>
<p>are you aware your system is crammed full?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m wondering if my girlfriend&#8217;s OS X desktop is still the worst I ever saw. But yours appears still a bit sorted <img src='http://storagemojo.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Anyway, I&#8217;m just waiting for seagate to bring the same hybrid option for a combo of 2.5&#8243; 15k drives with 8GB SLC. The price difference is so nicely low and I don&#8217;t think we&#8217;ll see cheaper, easier self-tuning storage tiering for a long time to come.</p>
<p>Florian</p>
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		<title>By: Brian&#8217;s Brain &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Seagate and SSDs: A Cautious Approach Is Nothing To Sneeze (At)</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209439</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian&#8217;s Brain &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Seagate and SSDs: A Cautious Approach Is Nothing To Sneeze (At)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Jun 2010 14:27:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209439</guid>
		<description>[...] is 7200 RPM, versus 5400 RPM in the first-generation hybrid HDD approach. And Seagate claims that Momentus XT prices will track those of conventional HDDs to within a capacity-dependent $50-90 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] is 7200 RPM, versus 5400 RPM in the first-generation hybrid HDD approach. And Seagate claims that Momentus XT prices will track those of conventional HDDs to within a capacity-dependent $50-90 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jacob Marley</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209421</link>
		<dc:creator>Jacob Marley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 May 2010 19:58:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209421</guid>
		<description>Making a lot of assumptions/simplification, if a user&#039;s average daily footprint of disk block reads is less than 4GB then the read cache will accelerate majority of IO.

If the footprint is larger  then like any cache overflow situation, the cache will be thrashed.  In this case a lot more writes to the cache, which leads to the question of are they doing any wear leveling or not?

Robin, 
Do you still have the drive?
Can you use it as your daily system drive and let us know how things pan out over a few weeks of use?

Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Making a lot of assumptions/simplification, if a user&#8217;s average daily footprint of disk block reads is less than 4GB then the read cache will accelerate majority of IO.</p>
<p>If the footprint is larger  then like any cache overflow situation, the cache will be thrashed.  In this case a lot more writes to the cache, which leads to the question of are they doing any wear leveling or not?</p>
<p>Robin,<br />
Do you still have the drive?<br />
Can you use it as your daily system drive and let us know how things pan out over a few weeks of use?</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: Greg Roody</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209399</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg Roody</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 May 2010 13:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209399</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see the concern here.  Putting cache on a storage device is a tried and true means of increasing performance.  Every modern storage array does this.

If data is in cache, the response time is orders of magnitude better than if you have a cache miss and have to go get it off the spinning brown stuff.  The algorithms that support the cache are the stuff of multi-million dollar patent fights.  Things like LRU, MRU, and pre-fetch separate cache from mere buffer.

Whether an app on a particular mac starts in 5 seconds or 6 isn&#039;t the point.

The design is unique, and it can&#039;t help but improve performance for certain workloads.  Like SSD&#039;s however, the challenge I think will be knowing which workloads gain most from it.  

For laptops, it&#039;s just a no-brainer though as long as the costs are not out of line.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see the concern here.  Putting cache on a storage device is a tried and true means of increasing performance.  Every modern storage array does this.</p>
<p>If data is in cache, the response time is orders of magnitude better than if you have a cache miss and have to go get it off the spinning brown stuff.  The algorithms that support the cache are the stuff of multi-million dollar patent fights.  Things like LRU, MRU, and pre-fetch separate cache from mere buffer.</p>
<p>Whether an app on a particular mac starts in 5 seconds or 6 isn&#8217;t the point.</p>
<p>The design is unique, and it can&#8217;t help but improve performance for certain workloads.  Like SSD&#8217;s however, the challenge I think will be knowing which workloads gain most from it.  </p>
<p>For laptops, it&#8217;s just a no-brainer though as long as the costs are not out of line.</p>
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		<title>By: Gonzague</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209381</link>
		<dc:creator>Gonzague</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 09:20:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209381</guid>
		<description>Robin : we get your point but i think the videos are quite misleading, one could think the perfomance gain from cold to hot startup time for the applications you launch in them is only the result of the drive&#039;s technology when its .. not :-s

The best videos -  imho - when it comes to showing the performances a drive can bring are done by comparing two identical setups w/ different drives :)

PS : i&#039;m not certain that a reboot cleans / empties the cache but Onyx does that pretty well --&gt; http://www.titanium.free.fr/index_us.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robin : we get your point but i think the videos are quite misleading, one could think the perfomance gain from cold to hot startup time for the applications you launch in them is only the result of the drive&#8217;s technology when its .. not :-s</p>
<p>The best videos &#8211;  imho &#8211; when it comes to showing the performances a drive can bring are done by comparing two identical setups w/ different drives <img src='http://storagemojo.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>PS : i&#8217;m not certain that a reboot cleans / empties the cache but Onyx does that pretty well &#8211;&gt; <a href="http://www.titanium.free.fr/index_us.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.titanium.free.fr/index_us.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Taylor</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209378</link>
		<dc:creator>Taylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 03:51:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209378</guid>
		<description>Thanks for clearing that up.  To be honest I am fairly excited about this drive.

Though, I wonder how it response to defragmenting of the filesystem. Hopefully, if you defrag after months of use, it doesn&#039;t take more months of use for it to adjust to new &quot;hot spot&quot; locations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for clearing that up.  To be honest I am fairly excited about this drive.</p>
<p>Though, I wonder how it response to defragmenting of the filesystem. Hopefully, if you defrag after months of use, it doesn&#8217;t take more months of use for it to adjust to new &#8220;hot spot&#8221; locations.</p>
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		<title>By: Robin Harris</title>
		<link>http://storagemojo.com/2010/05/24/seagate-gets-hybrid-ssdhdd-right/comment-page-1/#comment-209375</link>
		<dc:creator>Robin Harris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 May 2010 01:52:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://storagemojo.com/?p=2043#comment-209375</guid>
		<description>Taylor,

The first run in the video was the first startup on the XT. That should reflect what that drive does with no SSD caching. It is also in line with what I&#039;ve observed - but did not video - on my Hitachi 7200, 500 GB drive system drive. I re-ran the FCP startup test after re-booting the system to clear the caches. Instead of 10 seconds it took 17 - still much faster than even my 10k VelociRaptor. 

Other sites will detail timing and power. My approach is to look at the technology and what it delivers to people who don&#039;t read tech sites like AnandTech. While the XT certainly has room for improvement it is the first hybrid that delivers improvements that most civilians will appreciate.

Robin</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Taylor,</p>
<p>The first run in the video was the first startup on the XT. That should reflect what that drive does with no SSD caching. It is also in line with what I&#8217;ve observed &#8211; but did not video &#8211; on my Hitachi 7200, 500 GB drive system drive. I re-ran the FCP startup test after re-booting the system to clear the caches. Instead of 10 seconds it took 17 &#8211; still much faster than even my 10k VelociRaptor. </p>
<p>Other sites will detail timing and power. My approach is to look at the technology and what it delivers to people who don&#8217;t read tech sites like AnandTech. While the XT certainly has room for improvement it is the first hybrid that delivers improvements that most civilians will appreciate.</p>
<p>Robin</p>
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